Dead Batteries and Engine Hatch Override not working

alaskanduck

2018 Rinker 29QX. Stored at club outside.  Just wen to launch and batteries completely dead (another story). Connected portable jump starter to override and nothing (switch battery switch on and off).  I didn't connect backwards.  Had to use it once last summer when batteries died and hatch started up immediately after connecting to posts.  Tried two different portable starters with decent charge.  I assume batteries are connected, the guy who winterized didn't disconnect them past two years.

Fuse? Possible to manually open? Dead in water until I can get to batteries.

Thanks, Shawn

YYZRC

Can you plug into shore power and use hatch via onboard battery charger power?

alaskanduck

Thanks. It's a bow rider, not aware that I can plug into anything. I also don't believe it has an onboard battery charger.  Thought about installing one last summer the one time the batteries were dead but never did.  Engine hatch bypass worked just fine that time.

rasbury

Well...if the batteries were disconnected how was it closed? My 270 will work on shore power with no batteries in it but you don't have that...I would start at the switch and keep working back and find the problem before you get to the bilge!

YYZRC

My bad. I assume you also checked the hatch breaker. 

alaskanduck

No worries YYZRC.  It doesn't appear the Engine Hatch breaker is popped on dashboard (assuming it's the little black "button" under switch), I looked and pressed it, but honestly I am not very experienced or knowledgeable. It seems odd that there is not some manual way to open engine hatch other than then bypass which by googling does fail at times, kind of screwed until I figure this out.

YYZRC

Definitely not an uncommon issue.  Do you remember where the actuator mounts to the underside of the hatch?  Is there something nearby that you can remove to access the mount to remove the pin and lift the hatch manually?

alaskanduck

Okay, yacht club member and dealer tech support both said to try an "old school" charger connected to override posts to get some charge on batteries.  They are completely dead and sucking all the charge from portable jump start and engine hatch actuator not getting juice.  Trying to find someone with a charger I can borrow.

YYZRC

@LaRea maybe you can help here? I think there’s a diode on the hatch posts that might thwart your efforts to charge the battery via the hatch posts?

LaRea

I'm going to assume your 29QX has the same hatch circuit as the 280.  So IF that's true:

In normal operation, there is no connection between the override posts and the boat's battery.  A dead battery will not affect your ability to raise the hatch using the posts.  If you're putting 12V on the posts and nothing happens, I'd suspect corroded pins in the connector on the bottom of the actuator.  Or it could be that the actuator got seized up by putting the gears in tension.  

Putting a trickle charger on the override posts will not charge the battery because there's no connection to the battery.  In theory, you could charge the battery by pressing and holding the helm switch, but there's a 50% chance you'd get the polarity wrong.  

(Larger boats use a different hatch circuit with diodes and relays, and I'm pretty sure that circuit will not charge the battery either.)  

Aqua_Aura

When my 280 was dead no battery or charger would open the hatch. It would move very slowly a few inches up then stop. 

alaskanduck

Thanks LaRea, that make's sense and everything I've seen correlates to what you say. Wilson Marine Tech Support and the guy that winterized my boat both said to try charger but if there is no connection to battery then the fact portable starter did not open hatch had nothing to do with dead batteries. I just hooked up a charger for 4 hours (5 amps was going somewhere) and nothing, no power anywhere in boat and jump starter still does not budge the hatch. I'll try to find a schematic for 29QX to confirm but assuming what you say is correct, I have to somehow manually get the hatch open, correct? Problem is there are no handles, nothing to get ahold of.  It butts up to fiberglass back of rear seats.

I'll probably tow it to the dealer that sold me boat but they said I've tried everything they're aware of. 

LaRea

If you find schematics, share them here.  

Yes, there has to be some way to manually release the actuator by pulling the pin at the top.  I'm not familiar with that boat, but it's usually reached via a table base, or a vent or other removable panel.

I mentioned binding the actuator.  In some cases, if you hold the switch in the "down" position too long, it puts the actuator in tension.  That can bind the gears and lock the actuator from moving.  If that's what happened, once you release tension by pulling the pin, it will release the gears.  

alaskanduck

No luck with schematic yet. Found some for cuddy's (AC, generator, etc.). I can read a schematic pretty well, Elec Engineer back in a day but never really worked with electrical systems in car or boat.  The wiring schematics I've found are pretty simple compared to what I worked with years ago.

I'm assuming the club member who winterized for me last November opened and closed the engine hatch.  Something happened since then. I have no idea where the actuator is located in the engine compartment and where to look for panel but I'll give it a shot.

Say, if the override posts don't connect to battery, where is the ~5 amps the charger says it's putting out going? The portable jump starter? But it's fully charged.  Just wondering.  FYI when I attached charge to posts no amps until I connected jump starter and turned it on, I assumed charge was going to the battery. It's an ancient Sears charger from neighbor that you plug in, connect, and one guage for amps. 

LaRea

The posts are connected to the hatch actuator, so it's putting the 5 amps through that motor.  But that's not enough current to move anything.  (Assuming it's wired like a 280.)

alaskanduck

I could not figure out how to pull the pin or get the hatch open.  Towed it to service center where a good family friend works. I'm hoping they can find someone who has found the secret hatch for a 2018 Rinker 29QX BR:-)

LaRea

I'm looking at internet photos.  On the starboard side, there's a storage locker under the sunpad, right?  Inside that locker, there's a circular access panel.  Unscrew it and the actuator pin is right there.  

alaskanduck

Wow you are good! Boat's an hour away but will feed this to shop if I don't drive out after work tomorrow.

Michael T

@alaskanduck ....agree with you that @LaRea and "wow you're good" should always be part of the same thread! :-)

alaskanduck

Got the pin out and the engine hatch override worked.  Assume it was tension in the engine hatch motor that was released as @LaRea said.  According to the shop, batteries were being drained by "smart sensor bilge" and no onboard battery charger.  Boat set up wasn't meant for mooring in water.  First boat so learning as I go.

Thanks for all your help.

Shawn