gen set strainer

rasbury

as previous mention, my gen stopped and shut down on my maiden voyage...working on getting the manual....working on my brakes still and was looking around the engine compartment wondering about the gen and for grins hit the start and it started right up. I pulled the service panel and the only thing I see to check for fluid is the engine oil which is full. I wonder if something is stuck in the strainer? I see it but not sure how it comes apart. Also, previous discussion, no one seems to have a filter on their genneys but sure looks like there is one on this one.....so, I might be clogged and over heating or clogged and not getting enough fuel but it starts right up...how do I open the strainer? Have a servie manual ordered....

Black_Diamond

You have oil level AND coolant to check, it is a closed loop cooling system, you need to pull the top sound cover off to get to the cap (or tilt it back) the coolant reservoir is at the same end as the carb.  You can get this system air locked/air trapped and cause over heating too.  There are several postings about how to deal with this.  

You should have a sea strainer for the water inlet, the clear bowl unscrews and the screen comes out to clean - close the valve first or you'll have a submarine before you know it.  Don't lose the square o-ring that seals the bowl to the strainer top piece.  Add some plumbers grease to the o-ring when you reinstall.  If it has not been off in a while, they can be stubborn to get off, don't over tighten when you reinstall.  Same for your toilet and A/C strainers.  

If your pump impeller is bad you'll over heat and shut down too.  You'll need to backflush the heat exchanger to get the broken pieces out or even a new impeller might not fix the overheat issues.  From my other posting:

Check your raw water strainer that is is clean and not clogged

Check your raw water inlet at the hull that is is free of obstructions

Check the anode in the heat exchanger (they can break off if worn badly and plug the outlet

Backflush the heat exchanger to get any pieces of impeller out (make certain you use the correct hose to run the water backwards or you'll fill the engine with water)

I'll just say it again, my other postings with the links to the manuals are all you need for the 5e.  The Kawasaki engine manual is almost useless for the marine generator application. 

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rasbury

10 4, just need to dig in it I suppose...when I looked at the top cover it did not look like it comes off easy but will check in the am...

Black_Diamond

There are two long screws at the back of the cover, one at the front by the controller,  plus two screws at the top of the side panel near the carb (opposite end of the manual start switch box).  it is a bit tricky getting them back in, just warning you.   To get to the reservoir both panels need to come off (and to get to the backside spark plug).  So to summarize: (3) screws on top, two on the side.

If you just take out the one screw  from the top near the controller/service panel you can tilt the whole thing backwards and get to the pressure cap on the heat exchanger, but that's about it.  You may as well learn how to take it apart

rasbury

and there may be one more issue not thought of.....the pick up tube for the fuel does not allow the gen to drain the tank, correct? So at what fuel level does the gen run out of gas? I am going to do all the above regardless as I'm sure it just needs to be done anyway...I don't think it's been touched but it does look like the cover has been off...

Dream_Inn

Ras, generally around a 1/4 tank would do it. If you are below that then you probably don't have fuel in the lines.

rasbury

I'm not sure where I am at on fuel but I'm thinking I would have been around a quarter tank....I am ordering the water impeller kit and filter....any other must do's as far as "annual maintenance" would be helpful while I'm there! I need to pull a plug to confirm which ones I have....should the coolant be changed? The gen only has 21 hours on it but has been sitting a bit! I have some manuals on it I need to look back through.....I sure have bit off a mouthful with this boat!

Black_Diamond

You have a few things you should check anually besides the impeller:

* Anode - it is in the heat exchanger

* clean spark arrestor

* Check coolant level

I can tell you changing the antifreeze is a real PITA and I'd avoid opening the coolant system if you can avoid it.  You will get air trapped into the system and cause overheat shut downs, it can be avoided as I managed on mine last summer, so more an FYI. 

Plugs should be NGK BPR 4ES (long nose)

 

 

rasbury

I had them quote me the anode along with the impeller kit and plugs so will get that ordered...I would think the coolant would be do for change and a real concern is the drain pan has a lot of rust- I need to get that under control and slwed down as best I can...thanks for the info. I'm starting with service on the motor while getting this other stuff ordered.......how often should that coolant be changed?

Black_Diamond

The manual will tell you every 2 years, which is hogwash IMO. To change the fluid you pull the hose off the heat exchanger. It's a mess. Refilling is the tricky part to get the trapped air out. I filled the system and the reservoir, then used a 1/4" barbed fitting with a 1/8"npt end screwed into the air bleed fitting at the top rear of the heat exchanger. Connected a cheap hand pump for fluids ($15 at autozone) and pulled a vacumm on it with the rad cap on. It evacuates the air and draws in fluid from the reservoir (do not let it go empty doing this). Once I had all coolant, reinstall the plug and done.

rasbury

I am kind of looking over the gen set as I do the other service to the motor.  I have not pulled off the sound shield yet....I have pulled the service cover off and then there is another removable service cover on the right hand side which would look like the water inlet and also the water impeller.....in either of these areas I do not see a reservoir for the genny.....where the heck is it? I also am seeing what appears to be a in line fuel filter and then mounted on the fire wall what would appear to be a another filter or guessing fuel water separator as it has an inline filter....

Black_Diamond

The raw water pump is at the far end of the genset (opposite the carb).  The little service panel you see gets you to the fuel filter installed at the fuel pump inlet.  Personally, I removed mine and left the in-line filter mounted on the firewall, the one at the pump is extremely difficult to get to on my 342.  There is no water seperator (or at least on mine). 

Not sure what 'reservoir' you are looking for?  The fresh water flows from the thru hull, thru the strainer, to the raw water pump, then the water mixes with the exhaust and finally purged out with the exhaust throught the muffler.

Dream_Inn

BD, there is a little more.  Before it mixes with the exhaust, it goes thru a heat exchanger.  This where one side is the raw water, the other part is the antifreeze.  The exchanger is on the upper right side with twist radiator type cap (obviously use caution when hot).  There is an overheat hose that will flow into which is on the left side, near bottom.  Small plastic container.  That should have some fluid and just as important, the hose should be pushed to the bottom of it. (otherwise it won't draw it back when it cools - it will draw air).

rasbury

the coolant bottle is what I'm looking for...I don't see it...on the right side there is a removable panel which I'm thinking is the water inlet and the impeller.....pulled the service panel and don't see it there either!

TikiHut2

Mine is on the port side inside the sound sheild but way in the back. I had to look for it too. Tough to reach and would be a nightmare to fill/purge air from it's innards. Mine was completely serviced on a shop floor when the boats engine was removed a few years ago so I'm satisfied to let it be since it's running right.

 Proceed with all due care and follow the tips that these guys who've learned from pain/suffering on what to do and not do. If it runs fine don't break it and run the crap out of it. If it's problematic, focus on the parts that are causing issues and don't break something new while attempting/avoiding fixing another issue (I excel at this).

Good luck. Mike

Black_Diamond

@Dream: you completed the details  

I agree with Tiki, if it is not a problem (coolant/thermostat or leaks): don't mess with it.  I can speak with experience along with several others on here it is a pain and a mess to change the coolant and bleed the air successfully.  That assumes you can get to everything decently, which is usually not the case. 

8-}

 

rasbury

yes, there is a fine line there between normal maintenance and getting into a heep of trouble which I also excel in. I just hate the idea of breaking down when if I'd just.......I 'll stick with basics for now, I do need to check the gen coolant level if only to rule that out as a problem.

rasbury

well...getting to genny and sure at a crossroad....especially with not wanting to get into the coolant. We ran it during the survey for probably 30 mins, maybe more and the surveyor turned each electrical load on for a few mins. When we took it out the first time and ran it also but it petered out, sounded like it ran out of gas (was at a quarter tank or less). Anyway, wanted to change that impeller and got to it pretty easily, at least most of it anyway. So, do I hope it blew through since for all I know it was running fine? A good part of one fin is gone and part of another...hard to tell what size the pieces were when it came apart........what to do! I can put the new one in, it will shut off if it gets hot.....

Black_Diamond

OK here, one item at a time:

* impeller pieces: they almost always get stuck in the heat exchanger, so you need to backflush it.  Remove the anode from the heat exchanger, it looks like a pipe plug, will be towards you on the heat exchanger and pointing downward a bit.  Now the tricky part, at the opposite end of the heat exchanger you will see (or should) the water outlet tube going up to a vacuum break (loop) before coming back down and connecting to the exhaust.  On the pipe coming OUT of the heat exchanger, back flow water with a hose and the pieces will come out the hole where the anode plug was.  Beware: do the wrong tube end and you'll fill the engine with water!  FYI: change the impeller annually at a minimum

The 'out of gas' problem, I bet it was not out of gas!  #1 replace the spark plugs, there are (2) NGK BPR-4ES plugs.  #2 make sure your spark arrestor is clean.  #3 try running it with the service door of the sound cover OFF...this seems to be the solution to my problems.  

Black_Diamond

here are the manuals if you do not have them.

rasbury

thanks black.....so that hose, disconnect that hose and stick a hose in it...need to filter that out flow and make sure I see/find those pieces...had bought a new anode when I ordered the new impeller...at least I don't have to break into the coolant side and I have  new plugs already to install...the gen shows less than 100 hours on it and will change the oil and I have a new filter. Was a little surprised to see the oil for our operating temps is just ol sae 30...will probably use a synthetic oil.....

rasbury

I was also surprised during the survey the amount/lack of water coming out of the exhaust- I expected a good stream like an out board...it kind of was just spitting water but the surveyor said that was good.  Once I'm good to go on this, how fast can I be going and run the genny?

Dream_Inn

Good details BD!  Ras, it sounds like you'll be using that genny in no-time!  Make sure you carry spare plugs and impeller.  It will save the day (or weekend).

RY is correct, you can run the genny at any speed, but not sure why you would typically need to very often.

Black_Diamond

These engines do not like multi weight oils, stay with straight 30wt. Otherwise it will consume oil, so you'll have to check it often.

rasbury

to keep the kids quiet.....run the air mainly but also so they can watch tv without killing the battery. I got the plunger to run the genny out of the water so hopefully this evening I can get all this done and fire it up and see how it does! I am knocking down that list pretty well! I need to do the motor impeller and also change the foot oil.....my boat has fresh water cooling, is there more than one water pump in that system? I need to review the book but I have a raw water through hull as well as draw through the foot.....

Black_Diamond

The gen pulls the cooling water in from the thru hull, completely seperate from your engines. There are 2 pumps: raw water and another for the closed loop side, the closed loop side is not a worry unless it is leaking.

rasbury

where is the pump for the closed loop side? An that pump is just moving coolant. I spending more time in the engine compartment and starting to know my way around....

rasbury

well, success I think on the geny!

I was able to get the sound shield off with no issues to get a look at this thing...I installed the new impeller I guess without issue, I tried to bend the fins in the direction of rotation of the motor as best I could but did have trouble getting it to seat all the way in...I put the cover on and it seem to snug it down ok but I was a little concerned. One thing everyone better do is check their anode- mine was the original as it still had the same paint on it as the rest of the genny- when I pulled it out, there was NOTHIING there! In addition, it had coroded and "piled" up a bunch of goo around the hole for the anode to the point I thought I had the wrong replacement as I could not get the new one in! I poked around and broke up the goo around the hole at least and flushed it out real good and put it all back together.  I used the newly purchased **** for the thru hulls and fired it up, ran it for I'd guess 30/45 mins before I shut it down. Number one, surprised on how quiet it was although I'd suspect out on the water where it is really quiet the noise will be more and second, was surprised the out flow water was cool to the touch- I did have the water on pretty high and there was more water discharging I think than I saw when it was running on the water so perhaps I was moving more water through it than normal so it was cool. Anyway, tonight I will change the plugs and warm it up and change the oil. The pan on the bottom as well as some of the framing of the cover are rusted so I will clean that up best I can and spray it down with some of the anti rust crap I bought and see if I can slow down the process a bit and scratch this one off the list until next year for service...as long as nothing breaks on this thing, it seems pretty easy to do the normal service type work on it! This was a great week- windlass:fixed Garmin: installed Genny: serviced and ready for action. The only thing I really have left, at the moment, that does not work is the spot light(needs a new bulb) and the water system pump I need to replace as it overruns and over heats and then stops- I see a rebuild kit for it at a quick look for 50 bucks but have no idea what is really wrong with it (the pressure shut off does not seem to be working but if you tried to run it long enough to shower off I think it would shut down anyway) so replacing it and being done with it seems to be the way to go. I do need to change the foot oil and the water impeller on the motor but hey, I'm getting there from 3 months ago...and then there are the trailer brakes....

rasbury

ok, the word that is censored out is m u f f, what is up with that?

TikiHut2

M u f f: The devils triangle that often causes rational men to loose their mind (or at least their sense of direction).......  Needs censorship due to it's extremely powerful and dangerous magnetic field.

Hey, Great progress on the genset.

Replace the whole water pump.End of that story.

The drive oil is easy. drain n fill drive. Drain, rinse, refill tank. Check the Merc service sheet for details.

Don't handle the bulb on your spotlight with your bare hands. Oil from your fingers will often compromise the life of a high intensity bulb.

Brakes..... not a good idea to keep tempting fate on that one. If an insurance claim came up and they knew you were aware that the brakes didn't work it most definitely wouldn't go in your favor. But it sounds like your a lucky guy...

Have a great time tweaking the sea sled. Mike

rasbury

At this time I would like to say for the lawyers that someone impersonating me has been posting all kinds of lies about the brakes on my trailer. They work perfectly fine and as far as I know have always worked without a hitch.