hello, Mr. High Five...

212rowboat

Here we go again... grrrrr....

I've got a lock on a NiB high five.. it is a 20p, which tells me it is a quicksilver and not a merc, but it is hubbed right and brand spanking new for a ridiculous price I doubt I can pass on, unless....

I'm happy with my s/s 22p 14.25" turbo by precision, but I've noticed the water boils off it while dropping speed and then popping it after intersecting wakes.. cavitation, if you would.. this was apparent after losing the hydro-foil 'whale tail' off the drive..  even said, the 22p isn't exactly right, and I was waiting for a 21p of similar or duplicate geometry to present itself before seeking it, if you know what I mean.. I like deals, in other words..

anyway, this five blade 13.75" 20p s/s has presented itself.. from what I've read, the high five plays by it's own rules and doesn't adhere to classic theory of function whereas once you've nailed a geometry with another prop (a turbo, a mirage, a laser, ect) you can dang near mathematically dial it up and in so long as you stick with the specific geometry..

abrupt progressive pitch, for one.. sizable vents... both help hole shot, and both help top end- allowing you to run a slightly higher pitch than you can with others- but this is a five blade, and it bites differently, and 'sposedly it allows for a uniform 'across the face' pressure of each blade regardless of that blades position.. this allows ridiculous holding in rough seas, which is what I'm aiming for... I want the bite.. some say it increases top end, others say it hurts it.. I dunno.. I don't care.. I want hole shot and low planing w/ between 3 and 5* bowrise on plane, which equates to better fuel economy..

so... that was winded.. sorry.. question is for those w/ high five experience... what effect did pitch have when you swapped? is it true that the 5 is equiv to a 3blade of similar pitch? or.. would I want to drop or add pitch?  Again, this one is 20p.. it's going to be hard to say no to..   

212rowboat

uh... turns out there is also a 24p 'true' merc high five avail for actually less than the 20p...... too much prop for my lil 4.3/212?

Michael T

I have a folder of comprehensive notes on props I used to use, particularly props from Precision Propeller of Indiana amd Mercury props.  I'll try to find it to so I am confident of my advice. Until/if I can find the notes there are two givens with high five props that I can pass on with complete confidence (Pls note:my only experience with high fives has been with Merc high fives) Soooo, with a high five: 1. You will have a better hole shot BUT less top end - I have seen losses of 5 mph common.  2. On a fair number of boats the high five makes them really squirrely to handle, particularly at higher speeds and can make some turns weird. The performance of the high five by Merc is, in my opinion, VERY dependent on the specific characteristics of the boat`s hull architecture - strake position and length and keel delta pad if there is one and the pad's size and configuration.  Regarding Rinkers I have tried high fives on my boat and friends' boats on 232s with 502s, 190s with 4.3 LX and 350 mags, 192s with 4.3LX and 226 XLs with 350 mag. None of us kept the high five. Luckily, we had all made arrangements to return them without penalty. I would only buy a high five without the ability to return it if was REAL inexpensive. I like the basic Mercury stainless steel 3 blade for 90% of "normal" applications up to 60 mph. For a bit more "juice" I have sent the stock Merc ss props to be balanced, blue printed and polished. IF you are running over 50 mph (on a gps) that will make a difference if not the money is wasted. IF you are running over 60 mph then you can take the ss prop you have and have it balanced, blue printed, polished and even have it cupped, raked and trimmed OR buy a specialty prop from a specialist like Precision Propeller. For most boaters who want a reliable prop that has a decent hole shot, a reasonable lack of cavitation and a good top end that puts their engine in its proper wot rpm range a stock Merc ss prop can't be bettered. In my opinion. MT

floater212

well with what I have, 2005 212 xr1 350mpi, it came with a 19" high five.... very quick out of the hole, like 1-2 seconds, too fast for new skiers; then I got a 21" high five... better 3-6 seconds and enough power to pull out tree stumps or 3 kneeboarders. then I hit a submerged barge... killed the 21" ,not even good for an anchor, back to standard 4 blade 19", should be quick as the 21" high five, but not, faster? maybe the same but we carry a full boat and now there's not the power getting to the water. so I'm still looking for a high five 19" or 21" . FYI.... ron hill marine makes a high five that is the full 14 1/4" diameter and the blades are wider for more power, they claim it has only about 6% slip compared to the smaller and thinner high five of mercury's style at 15% slip. these are great for any kind of watersports.

212rowboat

Floater: the 19p4 is faster than the 21p5? Did I read that right?  That is curious.. it's part of the mystery around that fifth blade, and how it shakes up the rules.. I've read theory on the thing, which is contradictory depending on source.. merc is very high on them, all others not so much.. I've read contradictory personal accounts as well.. 

MT: I've found a trend that is absolute in that reversing with the fifth blade is less than optimal.. I've read that some boats get squirrly too.. I've read they bite hard in rough seas, though, as a trend, and there that suits me to a tee.. I want good cruise with bow between 3-5* at as low an rpm and speed as I can, but still have reserve on either side to outrun trouble or bite a bank and avoid it.. the top end doesn't worry me unless we're talking engine speed.. I want to keep the engine in its range.. 

Either way.. I'll have something to report soon.. I got it, and at $125.. it's too low to pass up.. if I don't like it I'll just sell it for what I've got in it and be happy... The turbo I that I have is fine, but biting slightly more than it should be at 22p.. if it was 21p I'd be happy as a clam, I'm thinking, except for cavitating spoken of above, and the inability to bank hard without losing grip.. I'll report back once it is installed and ran. 

212rowboat

Oh.. MT: of all the props I've ran in my entire life, the precision turbo is by far the best crafted.. the progressive sweep on that blade is perfection, and the cupping absolutely uniform from one blade to the next.. the vents are in perfect locations at the base of the face, and the welds aren't perceptible at all.. I really dig them.

Floater: I found this precision turbo on eBay last year.. ready for this? $40.. $12 shipping.. $52 invested in a stainless steel flawless prop.. you make more ponies than I do.. you may be interested in running it? Mebbe I could ship it to you if you pick the costs up, you run it, if you like it... Call it $50? :-) ... Of course, this is only if the h5 works out..

nhsd

If that High 5 doesn't float your boat, I have a 21 pitch Precision Turbo that I would be happy to trade you!!. It is older with the fixed hub, not the removable one... I would have to believe from what I have read, however, that you are going to like that H5.

V8192

+1 on the squirrely handling at speed, mine would launch onto a plane in a heartbeat and hold

a plane way down low but too twitchy and would over rev on top end but mine is a 17p with a 5.0

on a 192 I ended up with a 4 blade 20p no name I picked up on craigslist with a 3 blade Rapture

21p for $50 (I'm cheap too!) Have not tried the Rapture yet but like the 4 blade.

Michael T

To put it relative I have driven a Cigarette Top Gun wih twin 900 HP hawks at 90 mph and felt totally safe - totally. One time that I can still remember that scared the sh*t out of me was blasting along in my old Rinker 190 with a 350 mag and a new high five. I was rounding the corner of a river at about 45 mph (it wouldn't go any faster) and the boat went wacko. It took everything that I could do to control it. I was glad I was alone, no Admiral and no kids because I thought I was dead. When it was over, in about five minutes (seemed like a lifetime) I just sat there in a cold sweat and could hear the wind in the trees. An hour later I had my trusty Merc ss 3 blade 23" pitch prop that had been "breathed on" a little bit and was blowin' along down the same stretch of the river doing 51 mph with total control. I know it's just one guy's story but a lot of my friends have had similar experiences. I hear the high fives work great with the hull configuration of many bass boats which the dealer told me they were originally designed for - that and for tubing hole shots IF the owner REALLY watched their upper rpms to avoid over revving. My 2 cents. Okay my 3 cents. :-)  MT

212rowboat

I've made it a priority to stay in a reactive posture at work.. everything is done except for the variables that surface from time to time.. which means I can surf the web all day, looking all studious in front of my screen, making the passersby think "man that guy is intense".. or, I like to think so... Maybe my fellas think I surf porn all day.. it's hard to tell.. in truth, I search for boat porn all day.. props.. gadgets.. ropes.. anchors.. anchor winches.. (more on that later).. anyway..

There is confusion, contradiction, old theory of three and four blade props applied to this one, applications of boats/engines/weight/hull design.. man.. the only two things I've accomplished to find and serve as fact is that the 17p is a bad design and should be avoided.. the 19p is the holy grail for boarders, skiers, and deep water barefoot types, and the 26p is faster than logic dictates... Oh.. and reverse.. reverse bites a big one with these.. I've read of blowing out the prop out of the hole, in hard banks with a shallow draft, relearning the trim game, and not as much stern lift as you'd imagine.. then there is a huge contingent that won't let there's go under any circumstances...

I dunno what to believe..

I trust your experiences, MT, and won't take them lightly on my initial voyage.. I'll be aware of reverse and whip her about backwards in open water to get an idea.. and while alone I'll run through a sweet lil channel I know of to see how she bites at an ever increasing speed..

One thing all agree to, and what attracts me to the h5, is the same mechanism responsible for grip in rough seas also allows ultra low planing speeds..

When I run it, I'll report back in detail...

One more thing- the turbo I'm running now isn't the best in reverse either.. the vents that allow my decent hole shot now, in reverse, ventilate the prop and lessens bite.. for that reason, the h5 will be used at least initially with the vents plugged..

floater212

can't wait to hear your summary on the high five.... I think they are great, but so is the price just to try one, I was very happy with the one I used the most... full boat 8 - 10 people plus pulling someone on something.

212rowboat

Well... The freakin thing wasn't as advertised.. it's 12.75 diameter, not 13.75... It's going back..

I've already checked out hill marine (thanks for the tip!), and will be ordering a 19p 14.25" five blade... I'm about 4200~4300rpm with the turbo I 22p 14.125".. I'm thinking dropping the 3" will kick me up 600rpm, and be reduced about <100rpm due to swinging a bigger blade... That should put me at the top of rpm range of 4800rpm... According to prop calculator that accounts for blades, weight, hull type, power, and gear box, I should be at or around 48mph top speed, which is more than fine.. I should hold plane at around 16mph, again good, and I should be out of the hole in less than three seconds at 85% throttle, 0-30 in four seconds at same throttle.. Plus, the hill prop shouldn't be as bad in reverse as the h5, because it's swinging those bigger blades..

I'm almost certain my gearing is 1.62:1, but it could possibly be 1.81:1, which tosses those above calculated stats...

Ordering it tomorrow... When the wife isn't around.. :-)

Michael T

Drew, my apologies for forgetting your stats but I "think" you once said you have a 182 with a 4.3LX and Alpha 1. I think that is a 1.81:1 unless there is altitude gearing involved. The high five will lift the stern of the boat up which does give it a pretty decent hole shot. A friend reminded me that there can also be some significant RH torque steer. I didn't experience that, but I did experience some crazy chine walking with the H5.MT

212rowboat

it's a 212 captiva... not a whole lot different than the 182 for the purpose of this discussion, though..

even with the Hill prop, I figure I can get most of what I've got into it out of it if it doesn't work.

Michael T

Correct, but you you probably have the correct drive gear ratios at 1.62:1 as the 212 is heavier. Good luck and pls keep us posted as to your opinion on its performance. I would also be interested in knowing how the H5 performs on your boat with more people/gear on board. MT

212rowboat

there will be no high five on my rig... I have a ron hill pleasurefive inbound.. 19p 14.125".. I'm still tweaked about the 12.75" H5, which was actually a QuickSilver (but made along side the H5).. Turns out the guy didn't know there was a difference between long barrel and short- one for smallish outboards and one for larger outboards and stern-drives.. oh well.. all for the better.. I just have to explain to the wife why a $125 prop morphed into a $450 prop.. :-)

floater212

let us know all you can on how well or bad ( I doubt) it works. I'm thinking mine needs the 19" to, same size bigger engine lower gear ratio.... 212 rx1 350 MPI 2.0 ratio.

212rowboat

well..........

this is the precision turbo1, 14.25x22p three blade, obviously...

side by side comparison...

Ron Hill 'Pleasure 5' 14 1/8" x 19p....

I have to wait until later (hopefully this eve) to get a ride report.... One thing I noticed, is there is hardly any comprehensive reports/reviews of this prop anywhere on the web.... I'm aiming to fix that. :-)

JC290

Good luck and keep us posted