Milky oil again...

brianflhrcibrianflhrci Member Posts: 62 ✭✭
I am at my wits end...I recently saw oil pressure creeping up on our port 2003 mercuiser 5.0, I checked the oil and it was very milky.  Three weeks later and too much money with a boat mechanic he comes up with too much water in the gas and the leak down has cause the slow frothing of the oil.  He pumps out the gas, cleans the engine up and sends me on my way.  Cut to two weeks later, oil pressure starts to rise a bit, check the oil and bam!..Milky again.  He tested the manifolds and risers and said they were good to go..Any advice?

Thanks in advance,
Brian

Comments

  • Black_DiamondBlack_Diamond Member Posts: 5,439 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Your mechanic is looking in the wrong place IMO. No way is was water in the gas doing that. I'd check compression for a leaking head gasket then look for leaking intake gasket or cracked block/head. 

    Past owner of a 2003 342FV
    PC BYC, Holland, MI
  • 212rowboat212rowboat Member Posts: 2,593 ✭✭✭✭✭
    To add to what info BD wisely gave: front seal... It's behind timing chain and has ability to allow water to seep into oil...You said it took time for this to happen... An intake manifold that floods the valley would happen catastrophically... Cracked block would seep then gush... Bad head gasket would likely flood cylinders and hydro lock engine... I'm laying cash on front seal, as it would weep.. 
  • 212rowboat212rowboat Member Posts: 2,593 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Oh.... And I'd go to another mechanic, have them fix it, and send Bill to first mechanic via attorney... 
  • Michael TMichael T Member Posts: 7,227 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Front seal and head gasket are my top two culprits. Has the engine overheated to your knowledge? Warped head?  Sorry, none of this is "cheap" If your mechanic is clearly proved wrong with his first "repair" would he do the next stage of repairs at shop labor cost and maybe provide parts at his cost? Worth asking? Good luck. MT
  • brianflhrcibrianflhrci Member Posts: 62 ✭✭
    Thanks guys, I've already got a "friendly" message into the mechanic.
  • brianflhrcibrianflhrci Member Posts: 62 ✭✭
    No overheating that I am aware of
  • Lifes GoodLifes Good Member Posts: 465 ✭✭✭
    Head Gasket.... 
  • 212rowboat212rowboat Member Posts: 2,593 ✭✭✭✭✭
    One of the tell-tale signs of a head gasket are fluctuating temperatures... Does it fluctuate wildly? 
  • brianflhrcibrianflhrci Member Posts: 62 ✭✭
    Well found out what it was...not good news, there is a small crack in the block under the intake manifold, must be a small one that only dribbles a little when it heats up.  Good news is the boat was professionally winterized, I'm in discussions with the guy now and he wants "his guy" to look at it.  He was leaning very heavily to the freeze out plugs would pop instead of cracking the block.  From my current mechanic and all the truth on the Internet ;) it seems it can happen.  I am ready to go to count on this one if it goes downhill but I want to make sure I'm not crazy.  Any advice?

    Thanks,
    Brian
  • seadogsseadogs Member Posts: 66 ✭✭
    The 5.0 was known for to crack along the cylinder area of the block for a few years. They did not have to freeze. I put many in at  the dealer so be ready for them to say too bad. The crack runs front to back about halfway between the head gasket and the bottom of the lifter galley (every time).  If the crack is anywhere else you will have a good case. Good luck.
  • brianflhrcibrianflhrci Member Posts: 62 ✭✭
    Any documentation from Mercruiser on stats or maybe a TSB/Recall?
  • Michael TMichael T Member Posts: 7,227 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November 2014

    x

    Post edited by Michael T on
  • 212rowboat212rowboat Member Posts: 2,593 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Well found out what it was...not good news, there is a small crack in the block under the intake manifold, must be a small one that only dribbles a little when it heats up.  Good news is the boat was professionally winterized, I'm in discussions with the guy now and he wants "his guy" to look at it.  He was leaning very heavily to the freeze out plugs would pop instead of cracking the block.  From my current mechanic and all the truth on the Internet ;) it seems it can happen.  I am ready to go to count on this one if it goes downhill but I want to make sure I'm not crazy.  Any advice?

    Thanks,
    Brian

    ruhroh... sorry to hear that....

    I gotta say, that is a strange place for a crack due to improper winterizing if it is visible on the surface of the block..... how close is the nearest water passage?

    it sounds to me like something else........... which points to your builder.

    a crack high in the block not directly adjacent to a passage indicates it got hot.  Or, and more likely: it indicates improper torquing of either the heads or the intake manifold, again depending on where the crack is...

    different metals expand at different rates.. if the decks are clamped down with the right torque and with proper bolts, the movement is isolated between the two surfaces via gasket- which takes the brunt of the blow.  it's at that time, though, when temperature hasn't uniformed and all movement stopped, that you're at highest risk of blowing out a gasket (especially a head gasket)...

    problem: some folks don't use the right bolts- and opt for stuff like grade five or grade eight... I used to hate torque to yield bolts (tty), but have since learned to love them.. they stretch into the threads and lock, can't be seriously over torqued, but do this at a disadvantage of not being able to be used but once.  where grade five or eights are used is on intake manifolds more often than they should- and in the past was common practice... grade fives have good sheer strength, grade eights good resistance against stretch.... grade eights used on a modern engine that relies on the mating surface floating are a bad idea, as the clamping force is tremendous and the seating not likely to give much room no matter the temperature- which can result in cracking a block.  grade eights have little raised lines at each point of the hex's face and are easily identifiable because of that.. grade fives have five raised lines on the face of the bolt.

    a cracked high block, though, speaks of high temperature or improper torquing and use of improper bolts. 

    it's always the seemingly little things that nail ya, huh?

     
  • Black_DiamondBlack_Diamond Member Posts: 5,439 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Bad casting practices will doom a cast part too. The problem usually shows up long after the part is made too. 

    Good comment about the right grade fastener for the application. Far too often people up the grade assuming more must be better and even fewer torque them correctly on top of that. Even fewer know high tensile fasteners are a one and done deal, used properly. 

    Past owner of a 2003 342FV
    PC BYC, Holland, MI
  • Michael TMichael T Member Posts: 7,227 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Trying to remember but I'm pretty sure a good engine builder told me that the 302s are pretty far bored-out for the block size and more prone to cracking if the temp gets off. MT
  • 212rowboat212rowboat Member Posts: 2,593 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Michael T said:
    Trying to remember but I'm pretty sure a good engine builder told me that the 302s are pretty far bored-out for the block size and more prone to cracking if the temp gets off. MT

    you would be correct while speaking of Ford 302's... they don't appreciate it much....
    Ford defied GM's innovation of modular design, and still produced Windsors and Clevelands,  as an example, both in 351cid, but totally different engines...

    however, the Merc 5.0 is actually a GM build which is the modular designed 'small block', which is used from 283cid all the way to 400cid engines, which the only exchange being bore dimensions, pistons, and crank (stroke) on the rotating assembly (short block)...

    the famed Chevy Bowtie 302 was placed in '67-'70.5 Z28's only, and were in response to hotrodder's playing with the notion prior to them- it was a 283cid block with a 327cid crank in most cases, but could also be accomplished with a 327cid block and a 283cid crank... the compression, as you can imagine, on the 283cid fitted with the 327cid crank was high, and allowed for one powerful naturally aspirated engine (somewhere just above 400hp at the crank, though they were degraded from the factory, rated at a different RPM, and advertised as 290hp, and done so because of the IROC series and insurance purposes)...

    the 327cid block retrofitted with the 283cid crank was no slouch, though, and was a heckuva platform for boost due to it's squishy low compression.. they were fitted with hood defying high rise super chargers, and atop tunnel ram duel four barrel carbs of HUGE venturi's for silly high RPM powerbands (such as needed for drag racing)....

    meanwhile, Ford didn't have anything near so exciting for rodders to play with...

    the whole concept of 'stroking' came from bowtie rodders interchanging parts and pieces between the line up of small block engines... Mopar did the same as Chevy, offering the small block mopar in 318/340/360, which allowed for interchangeable parts, too...

    anyway... cool story I thought I'd share if anyone else finds it as interesting as me.


  • Dream_InnDream_Inn Member, Moderator Posts: 7,663 mod
    edited October 2014
    Drew, love the motor chat.  I used to have a 283 in my street rod.  Then changed it to a 327 with solid lifters.  I still have the truck, now a bit tamer with a 350 block (new from crate in 1992 - built for the vette).

    Oh, and Ford did make the 289 which was fun (my father had it in a t-bird with 3 speed...fun little toy).  But I agree Chevy made the easier to play with blocks!  (the Ford guys used to tell me no way, the distributor was in the front making Ford much easier...I'd just say once I had it set, no reason to mess with it). :

    Dream 'Inn III -- 2008 400 Express

  • brianflhrcibrianflhrci Member Posts: 62 ✭✭
    Thanks for all of the posts guys.  I'll definitely keep my fingers crossed.  That will certainly be bad news but we love the boat so it's worth the investment.
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