Aircon pump leaking

MarkB

I checked my mid berth sump tonight and found water in it. I went on a hunt and found my aircon water pump was leaking. I tried tightening the 3 screws on the feed flange but no luck. You can see one of the screws just to the right of the strainer on the brass fitting. I found 3 and tightened as much as possible (they were loose).

Not sure if I should pull the whole thing out and try and fix it myself or just get a mechanic out. I know it's guessing but anyone know if this is likely to be an easy fix or a pump replacement?

Appreciate any advice. Is there something easy I can check or try and fix?

Black_Diamond

My guestimate: replace. Either way you'll need to take it out. Can't hurt to pull it apart and see if it is just an o-ring. 

Michael T

....and for future notes for guys who will be winterizing next year (did I say that already lol) remove that bowl and zip tie it to a hose or leave it in a drink holder in the cockpit to avoid the AF turning the bowl cloudy...ask me how I know that one!

Mark you may be lucky and the O ring might swell again and stop the leak. See what happens in a day or two?

MarkB

Al my dealer (Dundas Marine) winterized. They are pretty good so I'm going to give them the benefit of the doubt. 

I'm going to pull off the plastic end cap and inspect the seal with the pump casing  (brass part) in position. The casing will be difficult to get out. There's 2 hose clamps around the casing that will be hard to back out due to cramped area.

Hopefully it's a matter of re-seating the o ring.

On another note does anyone know an easy way to reprime the AC pump without using a vacuum to suck through. I'm thinking if I just leave the pump discharge hose off and open the seacock it will fill up on its own. Then I can close the seacock and put the discharge hose back on. Wouldn't that work? @Alswagg

jme097

@MarkB last year on my buddies boat we just took a pump and a regular garden hose and pumped water in the discharge hole on the side of the boat. Worked like a charm. Took 30 seconds if that

Michael T

Mark, where have you been for the lengthy discussions on this with pics? :-)

As many have found simply opening the seacock isn't sufficient and if you don't want to try to prime it by taking it for a run - which doesn't always work - and never did for my EC 360...then:

Easiest: buy or make a valve assembly that works for summer priming and winter AF.

Next easiest: like jme097 says, reverse prime the pump from the front discharge hole

Next easiest: fill your strainer bowl, crack it a bit to create draw and start your HVAC - repeat a couple of times, if necessary

Funniest: do what I did before installing valve assemblies on my HVAC and Generator - take off the supply hose to the HVAC and suck on it while the Admiral turns on the HVAC, takes pictures to shame you and laughs her a** off.

If you search our threads there was a lot of discussion of this in the past.

Make sure your Admiral doesn't have her phone to late pictures!

MarkB

MT, I know, I've been through all those discussions. LOL.

I don't want to spend hours on this, I'm hoping I can pop off the pump cap, fix the oring and reassemble. Then I want the priming to be a 5 minute job. I'm not picky! LOL.

I'll try the reverse prime - I have pressurized water service at the doc.  Only thing is I don't know which of the 4 drain holes the aircon service water comes out of!!  @Mike_G can you tell me which one of the 4 through hull holes (just under the helm on starboard) the aircon water comes out of??  I think it's one of the two lower holes.

Michael T

Mark. I only did a "reverse prime" once but the Admiral just held a garden hose  to the discharge hole for the HVAC while I cracked the strainer bowl until some water shot out - then I fired up the HVAC and away it went.

MarkB

OK will try that, just hope I push the water through the right hole and not through my sink or something! LOL.

jme097

@MarkB I was wondering the same thing last winter when i winterized my 280's heat pump. You can poke your head in the compartment where the unit is and follow the discharge line to the discharge fitting on the side. You'll see 4 fittings very close to each other. Mine was the bottom left fitting I believe on my 280 but very well possibly could be different for you. 

MarkB

I'll pop the AC grill and see if I can peak behind the unit. Hopefully there's enough visibility to see which hole it comes out of. Thanks.

Michael T

....Mark that's easy for Al to say - the ice is probably out of the water where he lives LOL!

Mike_G

Hey @MarkB...  I have the 4 thru-hull holes on the starboard side under the helm, but I do not have AC/Heat.  Now I'm curious as to if they just capped it off, or if each one of those actually serves a purpose on my boat.

I figure that one is for the sink in the head, one is for the shower sump, one is for the cockpit drain that is behind the helm (if you look in the gap in front of where the cabin door slides in you can see it there) and that leaves one more.  Hmmm. Sorry I can't be of more help here right now.   -=Mike G.

MarkB

Mike G, you are correct.  One of the top ones is for the cabin bilge pump (where the shower sump is), I know because that's where my raw water for the A/C was being pumped out of as the bilge filled (due to the leak).

I figure the other top one is for the drain behind the helm.

That leaves the sink in the head, so I'll just open that and find out which hole that drain comes out of.

The one that remains is likely the AC raw water return.

MarkB

So I pulled the pump and I found the wet end is warped. It's plastic and due to the warp the o ring is not seating properly. Don't know how this happened. It's 4 years old.  I tried a bunch of stuff to try and stop the leak but it looks like I need to replace that part.

Fortunately there is a $30 kit to replace it. I just have to figure out how to get one to Toronto fast. 

Here's a picture of the warped part.

BellevilleMXZ

Able to find a supplier in Canada?

MarkB

I'm trying to find one. My wife happens to be in Florida right now, so I have one being shipped to her overnight from a FL supplier.  I'd get it next week then, when she's back.

I'm going to try and find Cal Marine's number and ask them for a local distributor. If I can find one locally, I can repair it tonight and keep the one from FL as a spare.

My pump is model MS-320-6B and the repair kit is MSR-3, which comes with a new wet end head (the one that's in the picture), a gasket and an impeller.

I'll tell you, with the design of these pumps, it's hard to drain them completely, unless you unscrew the entire wet end head.  So there's always going to be a risk of freeze damage.  Even taken off the suction feed strainer will leave half the pump full, as it's a center feed. That could damage the impeller or the wet end head.

Black_Diamond

Inside. Heated. Storage. 

Problem solved. lol

MarkB

Just a few updates.

The repair kit is not readily available in Toronto.  Can get the pump but who wants to spend $300 for a $20 part?!? Rather order online from the US.

Also I found a local fix.  I bought a bath tub drain gasket and cut the inner whole a little bigger in diameter to suit the pump. Reassembled a there you go. It sealed so well it actually started pumping water after cracking open and filling the feed strainer. I didn't even need to prime with the hose from the outside.  All working now.  Get yourself one of these as a back up.

Handymans342

Sometimes those homemade fixes work better than the factory

MarkB

It's definitely stronger than factory now. I've got a nice thick gasket in their instead of a 1 mm gadget that I can pick my teeth with.

The system is as strong as the weakest part. I don't know why they would compromise using such a cheap o ring.

Michael T

Nice work MB. Question, you run AF through your pump, right? How does it freeze? never had one freeze that I have heard of that was winterized with AF.

MarkB

My dealer winterized for me so I'm assuming they put AF through it.

Anyhow I'm not sure but the casing is warped a little. It's a soft plastic so it can warp without cracking. I can't think of any other reason for it to have warped like that.

With the new gasket which is much broader it seats properly so it really doesn't even matter anymore.