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Wiring diagram for battery charger/isolator/house battery/cranking batteries?

CTerrySGDCTerrySGD Member Posts: 18 ✭✭
in Electrical Discussions
Hi Everyone! New to the forum.  Thanks for having me!

I have a 2007 300EC with Volvo Penta 305's.  Had to have a new battery charger and batteries installed (2 cranking and 1 house) at the end of last year.  This year I haven't been able to get anything to run the way she used to.  I'm constantly seeing lower voltages on my gauges (cranking and house) then I ever did before.  Mechanic said that both alternators weren't charging so he hooked them up so both would contribute etc.... Started the season and would see 11.7v - 12.2v after leaving the charger go for days.  Called them and they tweaked something and now I'm seeing 12.8 and dropping to 12.5v while cruising.

I'm done letting someone else figure this out for me.  I'm going to re-build the wiring as it should be so I know everything is right and all of the wiring and connectors are good.  Would like to also add a 2nd house battery and inverter in the future.

I know I'm asking for a lot here so this is my basic question.  Does anyone have schematic that would match what I'm trying to accomplish so I can start tracing down the problem.  Going to get new batteries again so I can rule them out and the charger they installed last year is a ProMariner ProSport 20 Plus.  If that's junk or not right for my application, please let me know.  If you have time to add any comments about adding the 2nd house battery and/or inverter, please let me know :-)

Going to be systematically switching all light fixtures out to LED's so that will keep the load down on the house battery.  Just did the NAV lights and now I'm turning my attention on the house lights.

Thanks so much!  I promise to contribute to the forum with my progress and plenty of future posts that I can help with.

Chris
2007 300 EC
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    CTerrySGDCTerrySGD Member Posts: 18 ✭✭
    Forgot to add that the current battery isolater is a Guest Model# 2403 and I believe it to be original.  Not sure if that could be interfering.... Or corroded connections etc.
    2007 300 EC
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    CTerrySGDCTerrySGD Member Posts: 18 ✭✭
    And batteries are group 24 Interstate Marine flooded.... Last piece of info that I forgot :-)
    2007 300 EC
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    frenchshipfrenchship Member Posts: 1,079 ✭✭✭
    Terry,
    Welcome to this forum. I have a 2007 300 express with Mercruiser 5.0 MPI. And I do have the complete wiring diagram from Rinker, and also the wiring diagram from Mercruiser .
    i do not know the difference between your 300 EC and my model, but on my boat I do not have a battery isolator of any kind but the wiring diagram that was send to me by Randy Rinker those show one, the diagram is about 20 pages long.You could try o contact Rinker and ask them to send it to you for your model.
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    raybo3raybo3 Administrator Posts: 5,459 admin
    Frenchship I am willing to bet your isolator is in your electric panel and if it's like my 342 it's a real PITA to get to.
    2002 342 Fiesta Vee PC Point Of Pines YC Revere MA. popyc.org     raybo3@live.com
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    frenchshipfrenchship Member Posts: 1,079 ✭✭✭
     I had my electric panel remove a few time didn't see any isolator, but I surely have another look. When I talked to Randy about not finding any isolator a few years ago he mentioned that while at anchor I just need to close both switch on the engines and I would not drain my starting batteries it works so far, But definitely have a second look for that isolator 
    thanks for the Infos 
    Paul 

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    Handymans342Handymans342 Member Posts: 10,375 ✭✭✭✭✭
    My isolator is next to my genny. 
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    raybo3raybo3 Administrator Posts: 5,459 admin
    Paul that is not your electric panel.  The panel is where your circuit breakers are.
    2002 342 Fiesta Vee PC Point Of Pines YC Revere MA. popyc.org     raybo3@live.com
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    frenchshipfrenchship Member Posts: 1,079 ✭✭✭
    Sorry I only show you the switches that Randy told me to turn off. I will be at the boat tomorrow and have a look behind the electric panel and report back.
    Paul
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    raybo3raybo3 Administrator Posts: 5,459 admin
    It is inside the panel.  I am talking about the galvanic isolator. 
    2002 342 Fiesta Vee PC Point Of Pines YC Revere MA. popyc.org     raybo3@live.com
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    frenchshipfrenchship Member Posts: 1,079 ✭✭✭
    I did see that galvanic isolator before,so if I understand you this also the isolator switch for the batteries,but I does not have an actual knob where you can change the position the position to battery one or two or both as regular isolator switch?
    Thks 
    Paul
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    CTerrySGDCTerrySGD Member Posts: 18 ✭✭
    frenchship said:
    Terry,
    Welcome to this forum. I have a 2007 300 express with Mercruiser 5.0 MPI. And I do have the complete wiring diagram from Rinker, and also the wiring diagram from Mercruiser .
    i do not know the difference between your 300 EC and my model, but on my boat I do not have a battery isolator of any kind but the wiring diagram that was send to me by Randy Rinker those show one, the diagram is about 20 pages long.You could try o contact Rinker and ask them to send it to you for your model.
    Would you be able to email me the diagram you have for your 300?  Or is it a paper copy and not PDF?  Thanks for the info!

    Chris
    2007 300 EC
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    frenchshipfrenchship Member Posts: 1,079 ✭✭✭
    It is on paper for now, I will see if I can find the PDFs when it was sent to me
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    Cableguy GregCableguy Greg Member Posts: 5,012 ✭✭✭✭✭
    @raybo3 , the galvanic isolator and the battery isolator are two totally different things. The galvanic is for the A/C system and is behind the electric panel in the cabin. The battery isolater should be in the engine room. It is to prevent the batteries from discharging each other.
    2008 280 Express Cruiser, 6.2MPI, B3, Pittsburgh, PA "Blue Ayes"
    Go Steelers!!!
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    CTerrySGDCTerrySGD Member Posts: 18 ✭✭
    What does the Galvanic Isolator do? I found that behind the panel as well.
    2007 300 EC
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    frenchshipfrenchship Member Posts: 1,079 ✭✭✭
    Terry,
    have a look at this for Infos on isolators....
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    raybo3raybo3 Administrator Posts: 5,459 admin
    Cableguy Greg said:
    @raybo3 , the galvanic isolator and the battery isolator are two totally different things. The galvanic is for the A/C system and is behind the electric panel in the cabin. The battery isolater should be in the engine room. It is to prevent the batteries from discharging each other.
    Yes Greg I know I miss read the post. I was helping someone at my club with a galvanic problem and had that on my mind.... My bad.....lol Thanks for the info....
    2002 342 Fiesta Vee PC Point Of Pines YC Revere MA. popyc.org     raybo3@live.com
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    youstolemybeeryoustolemybeer Member Posts: 246 ✭✭✭
    are you seeing the voltage at the gauge on the dash or are you checking it straight off the battery? If off the dash then that is going to give you all sorts of weird numbers because  the gauge measures off one very small wire that feeds everything at the dash. Get a digital meter and measure off the batteries. Running you should see 13.5-14.5 .  If you get those numbers than I bet you dont have a problem.  
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    CTerrySGDCTerrySGD Member Posts: 18 ✭✭
    youstolemybeer said:
    are you seeing the voltage at the gauge on the dash or are you checking it straight off the battery? If off the dash then that is going to give you all sorts of weird numbers because  the gauge measures off one very small wire that feeds everything at the dash. Get a digital meter and measure off the batteries. Running you should see 13.5-14.5 .  If you get those numbers than I bet you dont have a problem.  
    Measuring three places.... One is the dash Faria gauges which I'm assuming is the two cranking batteries (and I'm sure can be off like you said based on my track record with Faria).  2nd is the Garmin Plotter which I think runs off the house battery but I'm not 100% on that. 3rd is the house battery meter on the house panel down below (previous years this would read mid to high 13's).  It have been reading 12.8 to 13 at the highest.  Now I'm not standing in front of it all the time but when I check it, I haven't seen anything above 13.

    Measuring at the battery itself is kinda hard while running as I would only be able to measure idle.  I don't have separate gear selection and throttle.... All one level on my boat.  Would have to connect some better wires to the battery and run up into the cockpit to measure with any real load on the engines.

    Thanks for any advice you have!
    2007 300 EC
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    youstolemybeeryoustolemybeer Member Posts: 246 ✭✭✭
    if your loosing voltage and nothing is on, it could be the batteries getting old or dirty connections.
    As far as checking the batt voltage while running, just start the engine and bring it up to about 1500 rpm then check the volts. you dont have to be on plane.
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    CTerrySGDCTerrySGD Member Posts: 18 ✭✭
    Okay.... Batteries pass test... They are still fine and should be since they are 6 months old.  Alternators pass test and are functioning as they should.

    Tested Guest battery isolator and found the problem.  It's not passing any voltage across the terminals.  Tried to find the same replacement part (Guest 2403) and it will take 10 days from manufacturer blah blah so ordered a newer digital version which is apparently "Smart".  No voltage loss across the terminals like the older diode style and will apparently act more like a battery charger and sense which batteries need a charge and regulate accordingly.  It's a ProMariner ProIsoCharge 2 Alt/ 4 Bank which is nice because now I can add an additional bank if I want in the future.  So now I'll have working alternators, new batteries, new battery charger and new isolator.  Will probably go off the deep end and replace cables and connectors all heat shrinked etc in the process.  I tend to over engineer things.

    Quick question... Any reason I can't remove the engine start battery lines off the output side of the regulator and jump them onto the input side coming from each motor?  That would at least charge my start batteries while running right?  Temporary fix until the new isolator comes in and I can install.  It requires two additional "key on" wires that I'll have to track down to energize the unit.

    Anyway.... Hopefully this will get me back up and running.  Annoying running at night and worrying about turning lights and things on to conserve batteries because alt is charging the batteries while running.

    In the process of all of this noticed that my Galvonic Isolator behind the circuit panel doesn't seem to be working either.  Still have yet to test, but the LED's that are supposed to be lit are not on and I'm in the mood of replacing things so I ordered a new 60 amp ProMariner and seems like a simple two wire install.  Hopefully I don't mess that up but sometimes when you think it will be easy, that's the hardest install of the season :-)

    Thanks for all of the help and wanted to give everyone an update.

    Chris
    2007 300 EC
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    CTerrySGDCTerrySGD Member Posts: 18 ✭✭
    Forgot to add that I've emailed Rinker and called a few times leaving messages.  No return answer in a few weeks time now..... Frustrating to hear for a company that is supposed to be rebuilding itself.
    2007 300 EC
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    Handymans342Handymans342 Member Posts: 10,375 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Yup, I called Friday and no answer yet
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    frenchshipfrenchship Member Posts: 1,079 ✭✭✭
    According to http://rinkerboats.vanillaforums.com/profile/wheatst at Rinker this problem of not returning calls and answering e-mails was suppose to be resolved....... I guest there is still some work to be done.
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    frenchshipfrenchship Member Posts: 1,079 ✭✭✭
    CTerry,
    if you can't get the wiring diagram from Rinker I could try to fax mine,since I could not the 
    PDF when it was send to me a few years ago. Let me know.
    Paul
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    CTerrySGDCTerrySGD Member Posts: 18 ✭✭
    That would be great! My fax # is 215-860-5300.  If you have a smart phone there is a wonderful app called scanner pro and also another called turbo scan.  I've used both for at work many times and scan everything in on my phone now.  Thank you!
    2007 300 EC
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    frenchshipfrenchship Member Posts: 1,079 ✭✭✭
    Ok,l will be home in a fews days and will send you what I have.
    Paul,
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    CTerrySGDCTerrySGD Member Posts: 18 ✭✭
    Okay... Been digging in on the DC system all week.  Started with the idea that I was going to upgrade to a digital 
    After realizing when reading the manual that I'd need to upgrade all of the DC engine bay wires to 1 gauge or 0 gauge wires I decided that was a winter project.  I like the idea of this isolator and the fact that it can pour both alternators into one battery if the other two are topped off, but don't want to re-wire the entire engine bay while the boat is in the water. 

    So I searched some more online and found an analog diode based direct replacement isolator.  Decided that this would be the best option for now.  

    http://www.arcomarine.com/xhtml/Pages 60-62 Battery Isolators.pdf

    Should be here Friday and we'll give her a whirl.....

    Just giving my Rinker peeps an update :-)
    2007 300 EC
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    frenchshipfrenchship Member Posts: 1,079 ✭✭✭
    C Terry,
    I didn't forgot your wiring schematic, it would be tomorrow or Tuesday 
    Paul
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    CTerrySGDCTerrySGD Member Posts: 18 ✭✭
    frenchship said:
    C Terry,
    I didn't forgot your wiring schematic, it would be tomorrow or Tuesday 
    Paul
    Thank you!
    2007 300 EC
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    frenchshipfrenchship Member Posts: 1,079 ✭✭✭
    CTerry,
    I just send you a PM.
    Paul

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