Gas during winter season

Michael T

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hanzelvh

Thanks all for your very interesting and learning info, especially MT and MB, learned a lot.
Finally I put her away with 1/3 gas left, treated ofcourse.
My boat is stored under roof in a non freezing hall.
Just 120 days (and nights) to go and than: LAUNCH!!!

06Rinker270

Wow my head hurts after reading this.  I know this is an old post and this topic has been beaten to death but have a few questions if they reach you...

@LaRea, what does an umbrella policy do and do you get it through your primary boat insurance?

@Michael T, I thought I read recently that you are changing the way you store your gas, this still true?

@MarkB I think I have to go with your strategy of gas 1/4 or 1/2 full with non ethanol.  Use it in the beginning of the season to start off with fresh gas.  Seems to make the most sense to me.  Do you still go this route?

Michael T

@06R270. Yes, I have changed my opinion on HOW much gas I will store in my cruiser's tanks over the winter.

I USED to add stabilizer to 91 (non-ethanol) FULL tanks and run the engines until at operating temperature then change the oil and filters and haul the boat for the rest.

NOW I am going to leave whatever level of gas is in my tanks (this year it happens to be about 20 gallons in each one) of 91 (non-ethanol) add stabilizer to the tanks and run them until the engines reach operating temperature, then change the oil and filters, then haul for the rest.

Unlike years past I will not fill my tanks to the top to store over the winter. That's a big change for me.

Handymans342

You will be fine MT. You store indoors right?

MarkB

Patrick,

I leave mine about 1/4 full, make sure I still stabilize though (last time I filled up). I do use non-ethanol, so maybe the stabilizer is overkill, but it doesn't hurt. I see it as protecting a fairly expensive investment.  First thing I do in spring before I head to my slip is fill her up with fresh, clean gas.

Michael T

@MarkB, that's what I will do this year. @H342, yes Steve it's indoors but not heated.

06Rinker270

Cool I'll be following your lead, thanks guys.  Good stuff to read. MT, are you going to add a gas lubricant as well?

Handymans342

MT, there is very little moisture in the air up there during the winter so I doubt much could get in the tanks. 

LaRea

A personal liability umbrella policy protects you from lawsuits and other liabilities that might exceed the coverage of your boat policy.  

For example: fuel spills.  When I switched from BoatUS to State Farm, the boat policies were virtually identical except for fuel spill coverage.  BoatUS covered $1M for fuel spill, and State Farm had almost nothing.  However, my State Farm umbrella policy would cover a fuel spill up to $3M.  So the combination gives me more coverage for a lot less money.

Or, getting back to the point of this thread:  if your boat policy has some obscure exclusion about storing the boat with empty fuel tanks, the umbrella policy would protect you.

Also, the umbrella policy is a general tool that isn't limited to boat incidents.  It will cover many other situations such as injury lawsuits.  Just sayin', talk to your insurance agent.

06Rinker270

@LaRea I am definitely going to talk to my provider as my policy is up for renewal at the end of November with BoatUS.  I have USAA for car and house, I may switch for the boat but so far I have been happy with BoatUS.  Although I have nothing to compare it too as I have only had insurance through them.  Thanks for the help.

Since you are relatively close to me, when do you winterize? 

Dream_Inn

Hey Patrick, I can help with your last question too.  I am doing some oil changes this weekend.  Winterizing is usually the last weekend in October and then cover the following weekend.  Sometimes it's covered by Halloween.  A few people on my dock wait another week or two, but it always seems I'm very happy and they are winterizing in cold wet weather.

The good news, I usually dewinterize the first weekend in March, but I make sure the 10-day forecast is completely above freezing.  This year I was on the boat one Saturday night in March where it dropped to 22 degrees.  Wasn't a big deal since I stayed on the boat and the heat worked great.

06Rinker270

Thanks for the input.  Is end of October normal?  My last two seasons I pulled out in mid November as I am slipped.  Maybe because you are on a lift?

I am with you on early March, need to prolong the season as long as possible!

Dream_Inn

mid November is usually fine.  I tend to do a lot on my maintenance list and take one last decent day to wax and then immediately cover.  It really makes it nice in the spring where I can remove the cover, put plug in and go.  In a matter of a couple hours (because cover takes a bit) my boat looks clean & waxed and out on the water in March.  & Actually on a lift really does not make that much difference until maybe January.  There is someone on my dock that goes each year until New Year's with his.  He likes to fish and winterizes the first week in Jan and is the only one out there with me in early March.

06Rinker270

I am going towards that approach this year.  Last two seasons I have spent too much time playing catch up come spring time, hauling out to bottom paint, etc.  Part of the reason was just buying the boat in November and winter prep not being done correctly by PO.  I also am doing a complete detail on hull before cover goes on.  No more shrink wrap!  God I cant imagine how big of a winter cover you got, where do you store that thing?  Mine is a nuisance.   

The 22 degree night, did you run the engine at all? That would FREAK me out.

MarkB

The absolute best thing to do is put your boat away fully prepared for direct use in Spring. What I mean by that is (1) clean and wax, (2) clean canvas and apply water proofing agent, apply vinyl protectant, steam clean carpets. Any other maintenance, like gelcoat work - do that as well (the fibreglass guys are alway crammed with too much work in spring). 

There's actually 2 reasons I do this. (1) less work to prepare when it comes out of winter storage and (2) you actually seal the boat surface better (gelcoat, canvas, etc.) so that the dust/elements do not penetrate the surface. Protects your boat during storage.

06Rinker270

How do you guys clean and water proof the canvas that is sewn in with eisenglass? 

Do you take off and store all the canvas or do you tuck it away in the boots?  Also do you leave the bimini SS poles up?

MarkB

My boat goes in indoor storage so I don't take off the canvas. I wish the canvas with soap, let it dry overnight and the very next day spray it with sunbrella or equivalent canvas sealer. There will be over spray onto the isinglass, so I very quickly wipe off the isinglass with a clean rag and plexus cleaner. I also watch for drips and recreation if necessary. There will also be over spray on the gelcoat, so I clean that as well. 

LaRea

I always stretch the season as long as I can.  My dream is to winterize just before Thanksgiving, but I don't always make it that late.  

I don't do major cleanup before winterizing.  For me, spring cleanup is part of the life-giving annual ritual.  I can always find time in February and March when the weather is good enough to work but it's still too early to launch.  That's when I compound and wax, clean the canvas, service the outdrives and touch up the bottom paint.  

Personality-driven?  I suppose.  If I didn't have a bunch of boat work to do in March, I think I'd explode waiting for launch day in April.

Dream_Inn

LaRea, I think I'd explode waiting for May as well.  I enjoy cleaning and getting her all ready for her sleep while it's warm out.  This spring is going to drive me crazy.  I'm putting her away a week or two early this year and will wait until April next year to get her out.  We have an 11 day vacation in March and might as well wait until after that.  The good news is I'll still be way ahead of everyone else, when I just lower the lift and go. :-)

Patrick, the night it was down to 22, I had both heaters running in the cabin and had that warming the cockpit area until about 8pm.  I had also ran the engines in the evening and that is enough heat for the night.  I also had it in the water which was about 38 degrees, which was good enough as well.  I didn't know until the next day that it was actually down that cold, but I'd say everything in the boat was at least 50 degrees most of the night, and the cabin was at a comfy 80.

Oh, and the cover, yes it is huge.  But, it is made out of stamoid light, so it actually weighs less than my old cover for my prior 310 (which was cotton from Fischer).  The cover has a nice comfy spot in the summer on a raised carpeted floor in a finished basement.  It switches spots with our dinghy and kayak in the summer :-)

06Rinker270

For the stabilizer, do you guys use Starton enzyme fuel treatment?  Or is there a better stabilizer for winter storage?

MarkB

That's what I use.

Michael T

Startron Gasoline additive. Make sure you don't dump the diesel additive in......and I put about 25% + more into the fuel to winterize than they recommend as I'll be topping-up the tanks in the Spring and will be adding more Startron at that time, anyway.

Dream_Inn

Yes, I use the startron as well.  I just double the dosage for winter.  I started using it year round this past summer.  Not sure if I notice any difference (not that I would), but I'll give it a go for another summer.

06Rinker270

Appreciate all the responses and help guys.  I filled up 25 gallons of non ethanol yesterday for my little over 1/4th tank for the winter layup.  Two more questions/topics: 

1) The octane was only 89, should I put something in it to take it up a bit?  Maybe do that in spring?  Or just fill up with fresh gas in spring? 

2) @Michael T do you still add a lubricant?  I believe I read somewhere you add a lubricant plus stabilizer.

Michael T

Yes I add Startron to the marina's "House" stabilizer. The marina, who winterizes adds a lubricant, I  think it's made by Stabil. Three years ago I called Starbrite, makers of Startron and they said to go ahead and add their product too as there would be no chemical conflict. Like DI I add a lot of extra Startron in the winter and add the recommended amounts during the boating season. I think filling your tanks to 1/4 is great (I did too) and I'll fill them up with fresh non-ethanol in the Spring. Around here we get 91 non-ethanol but 89 is still great its the 10% ethanol that the marine parts hate.

06Rinker270

Think I will do the same, add more than necessary.  Fill  her up in spring and go.

Is this the lubricant?  Or is this the same at Startron.

Michael T

@06R270 - I think this is what my marina puts in and I add the Startron.

MarkB

Is it ethanol free? That's the main issue. E89 on it's own isn't the problem if it's ethanol free.

I don't think I'd add more fuel. You'd need to add a lot more to up the rating. If you used 94, adding another 1/4 tank would push you up to 91.  Is 91 really that much better than 89??  I'd probably just wait and add fresh gas in the spring.

06Rinker270

Is its ethanol free.  I would not add more fuel now but add something in the spring to get the octane back up.  I guess the new gas in spring well help with that...