Conversation With A World Cruiser

Michael T

With best wishes from Aruba.

Saw a beautiful yacht cruise past Eagle Beach a couple of days ago. Was at dinner tonight at a waterfront restaurant (Matthew's) talking boats with a Canadian couple we met a week ago. We were discussing the yacht I had seen and trying to figure out what it was.

A guy a table over said "It is a 78 foot Flemming" (not sure I spelled that right). We started talking boats and the womens' eyes started to glaze over so the three of us went to the bar. I bought him a scotch. The boat was his. He and his Admiral (with guests) have cruised most of the world. Probably the most saavy boater I have ever talked with. 

Before I get to the Rinker word, here's a couple of things he said about his boat (wish I had a pen to take notes) and boats in general (and boy does he know boats).

His 78 has twin V-12 man diesels  (each one 1,500 HP) and can cruise at 9-10 knots for 2500 miles with a 15% reserve. The hull will plane at 18 knots +/- if he has to out run weather or has some other kind of emergency requiring more speed. He has twin 24KW  generators, 10,000 watt inverters and I can't remember the power of his battery banks and solar arrays but that was staggering too. I think he said the twin alternators were 250 amps each? All of his major systems are double redundant with critical ones triple.

Some of his interesting comments (opinions): remember how we have discussed sea anchors on this forum? - he said he never leaves the sight of land without having a drogue rigged. He knows Rinker boats well and offered the following opinion of boats and boatsales in general: Rinker Boats - the very best value for your money anywhere (as long as you are comparing well-built hulls). Rinker V.S. Sea Ray/Regal Formula - he said no one is getting rich making boats any more, the margins are so tight that most companies are fighting to survive. Rinker: incredible value for the product delivered - he knew everything I did about the Rinker EC 360 (fwiw). He said yes, a Sea Ray/Regal Formula cost more than a Rinker but they are obsessive about hull noise dampening, wire looming, fiberglass finish etc. They are not better boats just better finished - IF you want to pay for that - BUT - none of them is making any more % profit per model than the other. It is a very, very tough, cut-throat business. 

I asked him. You are going to buy a new cruiser. What is the most important option? He said okay - I don't consider something like radar an option or a generator if the boat is 35 feet or longer but imo within 10 years anyone trying to sell a twin engined boat (inboard or outboard) that doesn't have joystick control is going to have to discount the h*ll out of it - so if you are buying new get that option.

I wish I could remember the rest. I have to google Flemming 78 to see what one looks like.

BTW.....He knew the Rinker Forum and said (his words) "comment for comment, the most authoritative boating forum in the world."

Cheers from Aruba - thought you guys might find this interesting. Super glad you guys in the "snow belts" are having a great  finish to the boating season!

Handymans342

MT, can you go over to Bonaire and check out that Island. I really like what I see and read about it for Expats

LaRea

That's a lot of boat.  Do he and his Admiral operate it themselves, or do they have a crew?

davidbrooks

We have friends with a Fleming that tie up here in Annapolis.  They never leave the Chesapeake but just recently had their own get together here in Annapolis with at least a doz or more.  The vast majority were just like this guy.  World travelers.  Loving the lifestyle.   

Glassguy54

BoatTest.com just ran a review of the Fleming Yachts 65 yesterday (9-22) and summarized, and I'm paraphrasing, "Obviously, this is a boat done right in every respect.....Possibly most important, Tony Fleming himself has spent plenty of time and tens of thousands of miles cruising this model - something most boat builders don't have the time nor the money to do - and has shaken out every kink he could find."

Michael T

@davidbrooks, thanks for showing me how to spell Fleming! @Glassguy54 thanks for the link idea, I'll be looking at that in a minute! @La Rea, he said he has a guy who he uses in some circumstances but has done a lot of solo Captaining including an trip from California to Hawaii., all through the Caribbean and the South Seas.

He reminded me a lot of the guys on this forum, experienced boaters and cruisers who know what they are talking about, tell it straight and have nothing to prove to anyone. It was a lot of fun. 

Steve you would like Bonaire but remember it is mainly a coral island. The diving/snorkeling is first rate and there are great areas to moor and some great restaurants. IF you ever decide to go e.mail Clare or Al Jardine at Dive Provo in Turks and Caicos. They lived there for years and owned the biggest dive shop on the island. Al is a Captain of Open Waters and could give you great advice on charts etc.

Steve before you travel to the ABCs (Aruba, Bonaire, Curaco) - and I have  - may I recommend you try some of these areas: Bahamas, Bimini, The Abacos, Exuma and Turks and Caicos. They should all be easy distances with your diesels and you have twins so very safe for that type of adventure. I would add a second gps , rent a satellite phone, file chart plans with the USCG and rig a ready-made drogue and with that super solid Rinker 342 hull you'd be anchored in a sandy crystal-clear harbor in no time at all.

My only other suggestion, and I'm not trying to be a smart a$$ here, would be to discuss personal safety with the USCG. Most of the boaters I have talked cruising  with who boat outside the territorial waters of the United Stases and Canada arm themselves. 

Handymans342

Michael T said:

@davidbrooks, thanks for showing me how to spell Fleming! @Glassguy54 thanks for the link idea, I'll be looking at that in a minute! @La Rea, he said he has a guy who he uses in some circumstances but has done a lot of solo Captaining including an trip from California to Hawaii., all through the Caribbean and the South Seas.

He reminded me a lot of the guys on this forum, experienced boaters and cruisers who know what they are talking about, tell it straight and have nothing to prove to anyone. It was a lot of fun. 

Steve you would like Bonaire but remember it is mainly a coral island. The diving/snorkeling is first rate and there are great areas to moor and some great restaurants. IF you ever decide to go e.mail Clare or Al Jardine at Dive Provo in Turks and Caicos. They lived there for years and owned the biggest dive shop on the island. Al is a Captain of Open Waters and could give you great advice on charts etc.

Steve before you travel to the ABCs (Aruba, Bonaire, Curaco) - and I have  - may I recommend you try some of these areas: Bahamas, Bimini, The Abacos, Exuma and Turks and Caicos. They should all be easy distances with your diesels and you have twins so very safe for that type of adventure. I would add a second gps , rent a satellite phone, file chart plans with the USCG and rig a ready-made drogue and with that super solid Rinker 342 hull you'd be anchored in a sandy crystal-clear harbor in no time at all.

My only other suggestion, and I'm not trying to be a smart a$$ here, would be to discuss personal safety with the USCG. Most of the boaters I have talked cruising  with who boat outside the territorial waters of the United Stases and Canada arm themselves. 

MT, I was interested in the island because it is below the hurricane belt for one and they use the US dollar as their currency. They also have a retirement system if you deposit your SS check you will become a permanent resident. Now this would be a very long and interesting cruise for sure. I also carry a weapon when ever I leave the US waters. 

Handymans342

MT, are they still alive after the Turks were destroyed from Irma??

Michael T

Steve, you are 100% correct. The ABCs rarely get rough weather - or even rain.  All of them  are (imo)  are great places. Aruba is my favorite because the island has a lot more to do on it. Safe because of the island's relationship with Holland.  They use the U.S. currency as the #1 choice (Dutch Florins also accepted). You can become a permanent resident on Aruba too. The Turks and Caicos took quite a beating. The "big island" Providenciales had a lot of water damage and the wind took down a lot of the majestic Royal Palm trees. Friends of ours own the Ports Of Call resort on Providenciales and have offered temporary housing in resort rooms to 20 of their employees families who lost their houses. The cheap housing got blown down the cement constructed housing and resorts fared better. The nearby Island of Grand Turk (I usually dive every year at the Bohio Dive Resort) got hammered. They were without power and water island-wide for weeks. Probably 60% of the islanders lost their homes. The only good news is that the predicted 20 foot storm surge did not materialize or it would have been a nightmare. If I were going to retire in the Caribbean my choices would be first to last Aruba, Curacao, Bonaire - for exactly the reasons you mentioned.  Of course the reason we spend September in Aruba is the lack of bad weather.

bry1429

BoatTEST.com

http://www.boattest.com/review/fleming-yachts/3166_65

FLEMING IS A DIFFERENT BALL GAME !!!

rasbury

We saw a boat at a private marina last weekend that looked like a space ship...it was probably 40', was gray, windows were all dark tint. The whole boat was fully enclosed, no fly bridge. I tried to get closer-I assumed it moved up from s Florida for Irma - I'm thinking a 10 million plus boat, I was in awe and not doing justice trying to describe it..

randy56

Neat story MT, cool to meet people, enjoying the same interest/hobby, funny how guy's always separate, have one and chew the fat, the girls would have no interest.  The Fleming, I could sell my Rinker, with that cash, buy the line's,  bumpers, stock the bar and fridge maybe one fuel up for the Feming. but would not have a boat. lol 

LaRea

It's really interesting that he called the Rinker forum "authoritative."  Something about the brand seems to draw in people who know boating, want to learn more, and want to share.  

Hypothesis:  it's because of price range and value.  A boater who spends $80k on a Rinker is focused on value.  They probably do their own maintenance and troubleshooting, so they will rely more heavily on tools such as this forum.  A boater who spends $1M on a Formula 45 hires professionals to maintain her, so the owner has less need for online support.  

Or maybe that's nonsense.  Whatever the reason, I've never seen a forum with so much useful content and so many helpful people.  

rasbury

And there is a wide range of owners here....those like me that really can't afford this hobby and those that I'm sure could flip the keys to a mechanic and say " fix it " but all have that common thread of wanting to do it ourselves and learn...

Dream_Inn

@MichaelT - now you are talking my world!!  I know the Flemings inside and out.  Been studying them for a while now and the 78 is absolutely beautiful!!  Our next boat is planned to be the 55 Fleming!  Two weekends ago, there were 48 Flemings at the marina next to us (it's one of two Fleming services in the US).  They have every few years a welcome back and customer get-together.

Handymans342

I think one of the largest Fleming dealers is right near you Dream

Dream_Inn

Handymans342 said:

I think one of the largest Fleming dealers is right near you Dream

Yes, it is the largest Fleming dealer.  Really great people there as well.  I've chatted with them over at a local lunch hangout and they are really proud of the boats.  Even the ones that come back thru 20 years later and get retrofitted (which a lot of them do).

Stodge

We were supposed to go on the ABC cruise with Royal Caribbean in February, but they pulled the cruise out from under us to perform upgrades to the ship that was supposed to take us there.  But it's on the list for down the road and I hope to snorkel around the islands when I get there.  

Handymans342

MT, you mentioned that anyone who does not have the joystick control from Mercruiser will have to discount their price. Well Seastar Solutions makes one that will fit any twin setup. I did get a price for my 342 a few years ago and its was 20k+ and I told the rep that no one would buy it. So he said: What do you want to pay? Of course I said nothing and he could use my boat for a local test case. He didnt budge. I would still be interested.

LaRea

Does that mean we only have ten years until everybody has forgotten how to dock without a joystick?

davidbrooks

Yep. Who knows how to navigate with paper maps? That skill is mostly gone. Gonna be the same with docking.

Michael T

Steve, respectfully, - a slight correction - I mentioned that the guy with the Fleming said that without joystick control....  that said, I do agree with him that 35 feet and up will be a harder sell in the future as more and more joystick units and retrofits are available.

rasbury

Hey, I would love to forget about knowing how to dock- boats used to have sails or oars and we seem to tolerate this engine technology!

davidbrooks

@rasbury I hear ya.  Still believe in teaching the old ways though.  Took my son out sailing and purposely turtled the boat to teach him how to right it.  I feel the same about maps and other skills.  I used to be pretty nervous about docking.  Now with a little more experience and new props i am a lot more confident.  I feel like i have a ton of control now.  With all that being said. i would still love to have bow thrusters.

rasbury

Well at least with a 342 you have two motors...I'm a 270 and the duo props are amazing- a bow thruster would be night and day for me. Most of my boating does not involve much current, I just do the best I can. No insurance claims yet!

raybo3

I only use one engine (stbd) when I dock...... Just say'n.

rasbury

Wow @raybo3 that would be like having a bow thruster and not using it?

BellevilleMXZ

Wow nice boat , had never heard of them.

Michael T

@BMXZ neither had I!

raybo3

rasbury said:

Wow @raybo3 that would be like having a bow thruster and not using it?

Actually I use the port not the stbd. Not really ras I found that using both engines was harder to control the bow. It would "move" around too fast. Using one engine and "bumping" forward and rev seems to work for me in my new slip this year. If you saw the way I docked last year you would run away from me....lol They used to call me Capt Ron..... I would have to come in pretty hot or I would be caught in the current and pushed into docked boats.

MarkB

I'm going to guess that Fleming 70 is wider in beam than my 260EC was in LOA. LOL. That's one big boat! I wonder how much fuel it can hold? That would be one hefty gas station bill.

Sounds like a great experience MT. Enjoy your travels.